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Showing posts with label intelligent design. Show all posts
Showing posts with label intelligent design. Show all posts

Wednesday, March 27

@dustcirclenews - HEADLINES: Bradley Manning Nobel Peace Prize, Drone Warfare, Sweatshop Clothes, American Inequality, Cultural Assumptions, Intelligent Design Dishonesty, Economic Inequality Permanent, Brutal Reality of Israeli Occupation, Iraqi Birth Defects, Militant Atheism, Christian Privilege, Secrecy Corrodes Democracy, more.

Bradley Manning's Nobel Peace Prize
http://www.opednews.com/articles/Bradley-Manning-s-Nobel-Pe-by-David-Swanson-130325-607.html

Drone Warfare Is Neither Cheap, Nor Surgical, Nor Decisive
http://www.alternet.org/world/drone-warfare-neither-cheap-nor-surgical-nor-decisive

Are Your Clothes Made in a Sweatshop?
http://www.alternet.org/are-your-clothes-made-sweatshop

Five Ugly Extremes of Inequality in America-- The Contrasts Will Drop Your Chin to the Floor
http://www.alternet.org/economy/five-ugly-extremes-inequality-america-contrasts-will-drop-your-chin-floor

Viewing History Skeptically: On Shifting Cultural Assumptions and Attitudes
http://freethoughtblogs.com/brutereason/2013/03/23/viewing-history-skeptically-on-shifting-cultural-assumptions-and-attitudes/

Dishonesty of intelligent design “research”
http://openparachute.wordpress.com/2013/03/24/dishonesty-of-inteligent-design-research/

Bye, Bye American Dream! U.S. Economic Inequality Is Permanent, Study Finds

Obama Ignores the Ugly, Brutal Reality of Occupation and Colonization on His Israel Trip
http://www.alternet.org/world/obama-ignores-ugly-brutal-reality-occupation-and-colonization-his-israel-trip

Iraqi Birth Defects Worse than Hiroshima
http://intellihub.com/2013/03/23/iraqi-birth-defects-worse-than-hiroshima-graphic/

Indicators of War, Not Peace, in Obama’s Visit

Has militant atheism become a religion?
http://www.opednews.com/Quicklink/Has-militant-atheism-becom-in-Life_Arts-130325-479.html

Christianism, Christian Privilege, Christian Supremacy: Christianism in America
http://atheism.about.com/od/christianismnationalism/p/Christianism.htm?nl=1

How Secrecy Corrodes Democracy
http://consortiumnews.com/2013/02/06/how-secrecy-corrodes-democracy/

America Split in Two: Five Ugly Extremes of Inequality
http://www.commondreams.org/view/2013/03/25-3

Police drones? No thanks say local authorities
http://www.scnow.com/news/local/article_b599e3e4-9415-11e2-a5f0-0019bb30f31a.html

Guantanamo Exposes Reality of US Fascism

Sunday, December 2

02.Dec.2012 - NYC Shutting Down Occupy Sandy Relief, Organizing McDonalds and WalMart, Banksters = 4th branch of Government? Palestinian Statehood, Modern Day Slavery Victory, Tale of Lost American Liberty, Israel to Expand Settlements, Anti-Choice Zealots, Secret Watergate Files Released, more.

New Twitter Account! http://www.twitter.com/dustcirclenews  
Don't forget to go to dustcircle.com and sign up for our Newsletter - There's a Donation button, if you're inclined to give toward this site. Also, have you written a book? We'd like to read and review it.

NYC Threatens to Shut Down Occupy Sandy Relief Sites

While the history of relief efforts for Sandy victims in places such as Staten Island and Red Hook is still being written, a move on Friday by New York City will probably go down as one of the stupidest moves any governmental authority EVER made

Israel Pushes New Settlement Homes After UN Palestine Vote
The West Bank Jewish settlement of Beitar Ilit is seen through a barbed wire fence, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu is expected to push for new housing units in response to the UN vote on Palestinian statehood. (photo: Sebastian Scheiner/AP)

he Israeli prime minister, Binyamin Netanyahu, has ordered the construction of thousands of new homes in Jewish settlements in the occupied territories in what will be widely interpreted as retaliation for the United Nations vote to recognise a Palestinian state on Thursday.

Israel/Palestine
No more slaughter in Gaza!
http://www.socialistworld.net/doc/6045

Boy Scouts America: Anti Gay, Anti Atheist (BSA Blog Carnival)

The Boy Scouts Association of America not only promotes religion within their ranks, it explicitly states that without God in their lives, the children could never grow to become good people. This comes from the Boy Scout Handbook, in an archived version of the BSALegal.org website

Organizing McDonalds and Walmart
hat does the drama in Washington over the "fiscal cliff" have to do with strikes and work stoppages among America's lowest-paid workers at Walmart, McDonald's, Burger King, and Domino's Pizza? Everything.

http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/277-75/14814-organizing-mcdonalds-and-walmart

Will the West Survive Climate Change?
This year, summer came on like a grudge, with record-breaking heat, inescapable drought, and the sense that the effects of climate change had arrived - and that life in America's mythic frontier might never be the same.
http://readersupportednews.org/opinion2/271-38/14812-will-the-west-survive-climate-change

Are Banksters and the Fed Becoming the Fourth Branch of Our Government?
Despite its pathetic propaganda encouraging us to practice doublethink, the Federal Reserve freely admits that it is privately owned, is a monopoly empowered by Congress, and that it operates independently from -- above? -- Congress and the president.   Yet it pays its private undisclosed shareholders/owners huge rewards . . that it extracts from U.S. taxpayers!

For Amish, fastest-growing faith group in US, life is changing
As the Amish population in the US grows – forecast to hit 1 million by 2050 – the decline of farmland is forcing the community to spread to new areas and to evolve its agrarian culture.
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Society/2012/1130/For-Amish-fastest-growing-faith-group-in-US-life-is-changing

Is it Time for Evangelicals to Stop Opposing Gay Marriage?

I asked this question of Jim Daly – head of Focus on the Family — about eighteen months ago.  Jim is a famously irenic figure: earnest, thoroughly likable, palpably compassionate, and absolutely devoted to causes such as adoption and immigration reform and opposing human trafficking.  He also helms an organization that, its reputation on the Left notwithstanding, devotes the vast majority of its resources into serving families and children and only a tiny proportion to political advocacy.


Now What? The State Of Palestinian Statehood

Palestinian children play in the rubble of a house that was hit by an Israeli strike during Israel's recent military offensive in the Gaza Strip Saturday.
The United Nations General Assembly overwhelmingly passed a resolution Thursday that changed Palestinians' status to a "non-member observer state." It's a significant step in Palestinian-Israeli relations, but whether backward or forward depends on who's talking.

Is The Voting Rights Act Outdated?

For more than four decades, the Voting Rights Act never lost a court decision as it cut a path for minorities' increased participation in elections.

Revolution is female: the uprising of women in the Arab world
The Arabic word for revolution, thawra, has a female gender. So does the word ’huriya (freedom), and so does the word intifada (uprising). Sara Abbas talks to the social media revolutionaries behind The Uprising of Women in the Arab World, a facebook group that is taking patriarchy head-on
http://www.opendemocracy.net/5050/sara-abbas/revolution-is-female-uprising-of-women-in-arab-world

A victory against modern day slavery
The ILO Domestic Workers Convention was unthinkable just a few years ago. It represents the culmination of years of effort by domestic workers, advocates, and officials to shine a spotlight on a long-ignored but significant sector of the workforce, says Nisha Varia
http://www.opendemocracy.net/5050/nisha-varia/victory-against-modern-day-slavery

Abortion Rates Drop By 5 Percent In USAbortion Rates Drop By 5 Percent In US


Good news! The US abortion rate fell 5 percent between 2008 and 2009. Last week, the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) published the details for 2009, the most recent year for which statistics are available, and noted that this was the biggest one-year decline in at least a decade.
http://www.care2.com/causes/abortion-rates-drop-by-5-precent-in-us.html
Bradley Manning: A Tale of Liberty Lost in America
Over the past two and a half years, all of which he has spent in a military prison, much has been said about Bradley Manning, but nothing has been heard from him. That changed on Thursday, when the 23-year-old US army private accused of leaking classified documents to WikiLeaks testified at his court martial proceeding about the conditions of his detention.
http://prisonradio.wordpress.com/2012/12/01/bradley-manning-a-tale-of-liberty-lost-in-america/

Science, an essential part of culture
When peace was restored after the end of the Second World War, 44 countries convened in London to debate how to reconstruct educational systems and to enable countries to work together. Spurred on by France and Britain, the delegates decided to create an organization that would embody a culture of peace with the ultimate aim of preventing another world war. This was originally intended to be an educational and cultural organization, but two British biologists, Julian Huxley and Joseph Needham, proposed adding science to its agenda.
http://areycorneja.wordpress.com/2012/12/02/science-an-essential-part-of-culture/

Israel to expand settlements after UN vote on Palestine
The right-wing Zionist government of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has issued the go-ahead for the construction of 3,000 new housing units in occupied East Jerusalem and the West Bank and is putting 1,000 more on a fast track for permits. These moves are in retaliation for the United Nations General Assembly vote late Thursday night recognizing the Palestine Liberation Organization as a nonmember state.

What's Next for Anti-Choice Zealots?

After an election night thrashing, the movement hopes to make its message more palatable to the public.

8 Reasons Wall Street Greed Is the Cause, and the Solution, To Phony Fiscal Cliff Crisis

Big Finance is once again getting a free pass.
http://www.alternet.org/economy/eight-reasons-wall-street-greed-cause-and-solution-phony-fiscal-cliff-crisis

Strike Launches Largest Union Drive in US Fast Food History
Fast food workers across New York City stood up Thursday against the $200 billion fast food industry. (photo: Press TV)
hile the emblems of Wendy's, McDonald's, KFC, Domino's and other greasy dynasties are hard to escape in the American landscape, those who cook, clean, ring up orders and otherwise serve as the fulcrum of these franchises often go unnoticed. These workers, however, were hard to miss today as they stepped off burger assembly lines across New York City and into the street, picketing in front of their workplaces. The strike, which took place at numerous restaurants across the city, is the start of the largest effort to unionize fast food workers in American history. Organizers are calling the campaign Fast Food Forward.

Watergate Scandal: Secret Files Released
he US government has released more than 850 pages from the Watergate political scandal, providing new insights on privileged legal conversations and prison evaluations of several of the burglars in the case. A federal judge had decided earlier in November to unseal some material, but other records still remain off limits.
The Army Corps of Engineers caught in (another) lie

Strategic Maneuvers
The Revolving Door from the Pentagon to the Private Sector
The sinking of the Titanic
If you ever thought the story sounded fishy...


Richard Dawkins: Now Praise Intelligent Design

Bloomberg Praises ‘Occupy Sandy,’ Then Sends Police To Shut It Down

Occupy - The Movement And The Music - Spring 2013


Hundreds of Fast Food Workers Strike for Living Wage, Inspired by Wal-Mart Strike

US fiscal cliff could put economy into recessions

Breaking.. Laureates demand Nobel rescind Peace Prize to EU: time to award medals to Manning?

Marriage Equality Causes Fox News Analyst To Freak Out

DOCUMENTARIES OF THE DAY:

Cults: Dangerous Devotion


The Ascent of Money


Thursday, June 28

What's the Matter With Creationism?


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(AP Photo/Jae C. Hong, file) 
Do you know what the worst thing about the recent Gallup poll on evolution is? It isn’t that 46 percent of respondents are creationists (“God created human beings pretty much in their present form at one time within the last ten thousand years or so”). Or that 32 percent believe in “theistic evolution” (“Human beings have developed over millions of years from less advanced forms of life, but God guided this process”). Or that only 15 percent said humans evolved and “God had no part in this process.” It isn’t even that the percentage of Americans with creationist views has barely budged since 1982, when it was 44 percent, with a small rise in the no-God vote (up from 9 percent) coming at the expense of the divine-help position (down from 38 percent). Or that 58 percent of Republicans are creationists, although that does explain a lot.

About the Author

Katha Pollitt
Katha Pollitt
Katha Pollitt is well known for her wit and her keen sense of both the ridiculous and the sublime. Her "Subject to...

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A university press is placed on the chopping block while the school’s head coach is paid nearly seven times its annual operation cost.
A pregnant woman who tried to kill herself after the father of the unborn child left her could face up to sixty-five years in prison for attempted feticide and murder.
It’s that the proportion of college graduates who are creationists is exactly the same as for the general public. That’s right: 46 percent of Americans with sixteen long years of education under their belt believe the story of Adam and Eve is literally true. Even 25 percent of Americans with graduate degrees believe dinosaurs and humans romped together before Noah’s flood. Needless to say, this remarkable demonstration of educational failure attracts little attention from those who call for improving our schools.
My brilliant husband, a sociologist and political theorist, refuses to get upset about the poll. It’s quite annoying, actually. He thinks questions like these primarily elicit affirmations of identity, not literal convictions; declaring your belief in creationism is another way of saying you’re a good Christian. That does rather beg the question of what a good Christian is, and why so many think it means refusing to use the brains God gave you. And yes, as you may have suspected, according to the Pew Research Center, evangelicals are far more likely than those of other faiths to hold creationist views; just 24 percent of them believe in evolution. Mormons come in even lower, at 22 percent, although official church doctrine has no problem with evolution.
Why does it matter that almost half the country rejects the overwhelming evidence of evolution, with or without the hand of God? After all, Americans are famously ignorant of many things—like where Iran is or when World War II took place—and we are still here. One reason is that rejecting evolution expresses more than an inability to think critically; it relies on a fundamentally paranoid worldview. Think what the world would have to be like for evolution to be false. Almost every scientist on earth would have to be engaged in a fraud so complex and extensive it involved every field from archaeology, paleontology, geology and genetics to biology, chemistry and physics. And yet this massive concatenation of lies and delusion is so full of obvious holes that a pastor with a Bible-college degree or a homeschooling parent with no degree at all can see right through it. A flute discovered in southern Germany is 43,000 years old? Not bloody likely. It’s probably some old bone left over from an ancient barbecue. To celebrate its fifth anniversary, the Creation Museum in Petersburg, Kentucky, has installed a holographic exhibit of Lucy, the famous proto-human fossil, showing how she was really just a few-thousand-year-old ape after all.
Patricia Princehouse, director of the evolutionary biology program at Case Western Reserve University, laughed when I suggested to her that the Gallup survey shows that education doesn’t work. “There isn’t much evolution education in the schools,” she told me. “Most have no more than a lesson or two, and it isn’t presented as connected with the rest of biology.” In fact, students may not even get that much exposure. Nationally, Princehouse said, at least 13 percent of biology teachers teach “young earth” creationism (not just humans but the earth itself is only 10,000 years old or thereabouts), despite laws forbidding it, and some 60 percent teach a watered-down version of evolution. They have to get along with their neighbors, after all. In Tennessee, home of the Scopes trial, a new law actually makes teaching creationism legal. “No one takes them to court,” Princehouse told me, “because creationism is so popular. Those who object are isolated and afraid of reprisals.” People tend to forget that Clarence Darrow lost the Scopes trial; until the Supreme Court ruled otherwise in 1968, it was illegal to teach evolution in public schools in about half a dozen states.
Kenneth Miller, a biology professor at Brown University and practicing Catholic who is a leading voice against creationism, agrees with Princehouse. “Science education has been remarkably ineffective,” he told me. “Those of us in the scientific community who are religious have a tremendous amount of work to do in the faith community.” Why bother? “There’s a potential for great harm when nearly half the population rejects the central organizing principle of the biological sciences. It’s useful for us as a species to understand that we are a recent appearance on this planet and that 99.9 percent of all species that have ever existed have gone extinct.” Evangelical parents may care less that their children learn science than that they avoid going to hell, but Miller points out that many of the major challenges facing the nation—and the world—are scientific in nature: climate change and energy policy, for instance. “To have a near majority essentially rejecting the scientific method is very troubling,” he says. And to have solidly grounded science waved away as political and theological propaganda could not come at a worse time. “Sea-level rise” is a “left-wing term,” said Virginia state legislator Chris Stolle, a Republican, successfully urging its replacement in a state-commissioned study by the expression “recurrent flooding.”
The group Answers in Genesis, which runs the Creation Museum, has plans to build a full-size replica of Noah’s Ark as part of its Ark Encounter theme park. If that “recurrent flooding” really gets going, you may wish you’d booked a cabin.
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Tuesday, February 14

The Trouble With Theistic Evolution

Category: Religion

Posted on: February 12, 2012 4:39 PM, by Jason Rosenhouse
[REPRINT]
 
The current issue of The Philosopher's Magazine contains a lengthy interview with philosopher Elliott Sober, a prominent philosopher of biology.

Most of the interview focuses on the problem of reconciling evolution and theism, with Sober serving up the standard talking points. For me the interview is a reminder of what I find most frustrating about theistic evolution. Too often the defender of reconciliation acts as though his job is done as soon as he has tossed off a logically possible scenario that includes both God and evolution.

The interview does not seem to be freely available online, so I will transcribe a few sections. The first person pronouns refer to the interviewer, James Garvey.

The interview starts off acceptably enough, with Sober discussing the threat of religious extremism both in society generally and in science education. But things go wrong when Sober is asked to discuss the various views people hold on this subject:

I ask Sober to outline the opposing positions in the debate about evolution and God, and he does it in a nutshell. “Creationists think, `If God exists then evolutionary theory must be false. Of course God exists. Therefore, evolutionary theory must be false.' A certain kind of atheist thinks, `If evolutionary theory is true, there can't be a God. Evolutionary theory is true. Therefore, there is no God.' I dislike both of these arguments.” He claims that the two main camps in the debate are both wrong. Both presuppose that conclusions about the existence of God tumble straight out of evolutionary theory, but Sober argues that philosophy is needed to from science to atheistic or theistic conclusions.

Even as a nutshell summary this is far too simplistic to be helpful. Maybe you can find a few atheists who argue in the way Sober describes, but most do not. From the other side, few creationists are really as simple-minded as Sober's version of their argument suggests.

The argument from evolution to atheism, or from theism to no evolution, proceeds by looking at what evolution says about natural history, adding a few premises about God's nature and goals, and then concluding that it is very unlikely that evolution and theism are both true. For example, evolution claims that natural history is marked by millions of years of cruel and savage bloodsport. This seems odd if we assume that God is all-loving and all-powerful. Likewise, evolution strongly suggests that human beings are just one more animal species among many. How do we explain this, if we assume that God created the world specifically so that humans could live? The parts where we insert premises about God's nature and goals involve doing philosophy and not science, but so what? Labeling the argument “philosophical” does not negate its force.

If you want to avoid the unwanted conclusions of either “No God,&rdquo or “No evolution,” then you can certainly add other premises. You can argue, as many do, that God had creative goals that absolutely could not have been achieved through any mechanism other than Darwinian evolution. Or you can argue that human-like intelligence was an inevitable end result of the evolutionary process. These are the sorts of premises you have to add to reconcile evolution and theism, but good luck trying to make them seem plausible. The incompatibilist argument takes its premises from the traditional, centuries-old teachings of various religious faiths. The compatibilist argument, by contrast, simply invents premises for which there is no evidence, for no reason other than to avoid unpleasant conclusions.

There is an analogy here with the argument from evil, which comes in two forms. In the logical form of the argument we assert that there is a contradiction entailed in believing that God and evil both exist. This argument has had its defenders over the years, but nowadays most philosophers find it overly ambitious. The evidential form of the argument, by contrast, claims more modestly that the prevalence of evil and suffering are strong evidence against God. Many philosophers defend this argument, and rightly so, since it is very powerful.

And that's my main beef with so many defenders of theistic evolution. They act as though their job is done when they have refuted the logical form of the incompatibility argument. The evidential form, however, is unimpressed by their efforts. Their refutations are inevitably based on premises that are logically possible, but highly implausible.

This becomes clear when Sober provides specific suggestions for reconciling God and evolution. His first suggestion is that God established the initial conditions of the universe and then allowed natural forces to do the rest. This is possible, of course. But what reason is there for believing it? And why would God create through savage natural processes when it certainly seems as though he had other options? And why would he employ a process that is not even assured of producing multicellularity, much less human-like intelligence?

Sober's second suggestion involves God personally manipulating the mutations. He provides an analogy:

Suppose we're going to examine gambles made on the outcome of coin tossing, and we want to know whether coins land heads more often when gamblers bet on tails. So let's do the experiment, go to a casino, watch people make bets, and get the frequencies of heads and tails. We will discover, of course, that what's good for the gambler has no causal relevance to how the coin behaves. It's wishful thinking to think that the coin is going to land heads more often just because you bet on heads, just because it would be good for you. And that's how mutations are according to our understanding of mutation. Whether a mutation occurs or does not occur is not affected by whether it would be good for the organism.

Go back to the coins. Suppose someone said, “Okay, you just got all the frequency data on heads and tails in your experiment. How do you know that on toss 342 God didn't intervene and ensure that it would land heads?' I think maybe you could have a reason for thinking that's wrong, but the frequency data you obtained in your experiment is not that reason. Frequency data do not tell you anything about the causes of individual coin tosses, so it's consistent with your perfectly reasonable view about coin tosses not being influenced by what would be good for gamblers, to think that occasionally in the history of coin tossing God reaches into the world and biases the coin. Not that it's true, but it's consistent with what you know.

It would be pretty remarkable if the experiments that biologists do on mutations would tell us whether divine intervention occurs. That's not what science is about. It's not about trying to test things like that. The theory of evolution is a probabilistic theory. It does not tell you what causes each and every thing that happens. Maybe there are hidden variables. Maybe some events happen for special reasons that are not described by the theory. The theory just doesn't say anything about that. I see no reason to believe in these hidden variables -- that's me the philosopher talking -- but the science understood correctly is silent on whether there are such hidden causes. (Emphasis added).

Notice just how tepid Sober's conclusions are. Hypothesizing direct divine action in evolution is consistent with the science. Evolutionary theory cannot absolutely rule out such a thing. But for me those two statements I placed in bold face really give the game away. Near the end he notes that there is no reason to believe in the sorts of hidden variables he discusses. Earlier he tells us that there could be good reasons for thinking that God does not intervene to affect the outcomes of coin tosses. Presumably he is talking about theological reasons, since he emphasizes that empirical data is silent on such questions. Certainly, given reasonable assumptions about the nature of God's interactions with the world, it becomes implausible to think that God is intervening in coin tosses.

But the same objection applies to God influencing specific mutations. If he is going to micromanage at that level, then why not skip the bloodsport by creating ex nihilo, precisely as the Bible says He did? Why does God operate in a way that seems tailor made to fool us regarding how nature works, by using what seem like random processes as a way of covering His tracks?

So, congratulations on showing that evolution does not flatly rule out the existence of God But by emphasizing that reconciliation entails believing premises for which there is no evidence, and which are strongly challenged on theological grounds, your victory seems Pyrrhic.

By this point in the interview I was getting pretty frustrated. But then, to my delight, Garvey made the correct point:

But doesn't evolution suggest there's no God? Doesn't evolution really very strongly point towards atheism? You can agree with Sober and think that, all right, strictly speaking, there's no incompatibility between the existence of God and evolution, but there's a strange hollowness in the thought. It's like someone defending the right to bear arms by pointing out that guns don't kill people, people kill people. Well, all right, strictly speaking, that's true, but guns aren't exactly neutral either. They point to something in our culture, they suggest a use. The theory of evolution, again strictly speaking, doesn't say that God doesn't exist, but it suggests atheism. For one thing, it knocks aside the idea that we need a Creator to explain life. The theory of evolution points to atheism, doesn't it?

Bingo! That's exactly right, and unless Sober has a good response his earlier harrumphing about where science ends and philosophy begins doesn't amount to much. But he doesn't have a good answer. In fact, his answer is jaw-dropping:

“It certainly suggests to some individuals that atheism is true,” Sober admits. “But I think that most of the impetus to that thought is just the old problem of evil. I don't think the theory of evolution does anything to challenge theism beyond what the problem of evil does.”

Now, even if the problem of evil really were the only problem then, as we like to say at Passover, dayenu. In the interview Sober does not even hint at a solution to the problem, but instead gets sidetracked on a digression about Darwin's religious views.

But come on! The problem of evil is the only issue? Garvey already alluded to a second problem, that evolution kills the best argument ever devised for God's existence. A third challenge comes from evolution's implications for the non-special role of humans within creation. And have we forgotten the Bible? Theism by itself may not entail an acceptance of what the Bible says, but since we are having this discussion specifically in the context of the American political and educational climate it seems like a mighty big thing to overlook.

It is when you start to appreciate the cumulative challenge evolution poses that you become distinctly unimpressed with the arguments made by theistic evolutionists. Sure, a skillful philosopher can go through each of my points and make stuff up in reply, just as a skillful defense attorney can poke holes in any piece of evidence the prosecution presents. But at some point, such efforts notwithstanding, the evidence just becomes too strong to resist.

Near the end of the interview we come to this:

And on the other hand, if he manages to persuade theists, he says, “maybe the reaction against evolution will be less extreme. Theists can accept evolution and believe in God. This compatibilist view is the least visible of the views out there in the public debate. Incompatibilism is the dominant idea whether you're talking about creationists who reject evolution or evolutionists who reject theism. I want to insert this third idea into the discussion.

I very much doubt that Sober will have much luck persuading theists skeptical of evolution. Considering the detached, academic way he discusses this issue, with his emphasis on the need to accept evidence-free, theologically dubious premises to support reconciliation, I think he is more likely to drive them over to the incompatibilist camp. They will not hear Sober's arguments, slap their foreheads, and realize that their skepticism is misplaced. Instead they will see only a confirmation of what they always feared.
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